Secret Six Discussion
January 8th, 2009 by Esther Inglis-Arkell | Tags: DC comics, Gail Simone, Secret SixSometimes you’re on your computer, you’re not going anywhere, and you just want to yack about a comic with people.
Go below the cut to start flapping your fingers about Secret Six. Don’t click if you don’t want to get, as the kids say, ‘spoiled.’
Ideas for discussion:
1. The big reveal about Junior at the end of issue #5. Did you like it? Did it make a difference? Personally, I like that there is now another female villain who isn’t afflicted with a crippling case of The Sexies. You know – that thing that makes them wear tight clothes and try to vamp the heroes every time they get in trouble?
2. Social cohesion in the group. Will it fail? All I’m seeing is petty sniping right now.
3. Bane as a member. Love him? Hate him? Will his relationship with Scandal end in mutual misery?
4. Did you think this issue as a ‘Faces of Evil’ issue worked?
5. Whatever the hell you want to talk about.
6. Oh, and what about Jeanette. Does anyone know where she comes from or is she a new invention?
Similar Posts:
- Secret Six Discussion Part II
- The Secret Six Characters are Perfect
- Visitors and Fish
- Emotional Manipulation
- Top 8 of 08 #6: eMC – The Show
I think Bane is a pretty fantastic addition, but I like him better when he’s acting like Scandal’s babysitter then when he’s doing a Marv impersonation.
@Tucker Stone: He does have a style that plays off of the rest of the group. And also yeah, torture scenes are never my favorite part of a story.
@Esther Inglis-Arkell: I’m curious– how do you feel about this Bane vs Knightfall-era Bane? I’ve read a few Bane stories (Knightfall, that one where he thought he was Bruce’s brother, this one) and they all seem to have fairly different versions of the same character. Does it seem like that to you?
1. I like the reveal of Junior being a deformed woman (looks a bit like Grandma L’Angelle from Preacher), though being Ragdoll’s sister seems a bit unnecessary, and maybe conflicts with the Starman series saying her father was a bit of a loser, conventional costumed villain and only became a sicko in his later years. Though I don’t know a great deal about Ragdoll overall to say. The surprise gender also made me go “ahhhhh” when I thought it was ironically a bit Women in Refrigerators when he twisted a female prositutes head round in an earlier issue. Damn you for not being a hypocrite, Simone!!
2. I like the group’s dynamic.
3. Bane is awesome.Nothing else to say.
4. It kinda failed as a Faces of Evil for me, because well, Deadshot isn’t “evil” per say, and in Secret Six, he’s comparitively a “Good Guy”, plus nothing much really happened to him personally to warrant this spotlight on him. Bane would have been better, since we got inside his head and saw how his morality works.
5. Glad to see that all the scrubs and new character villains got offed, while the likes of Lady Vic and The Shark lived through it. Jeneatte’s methods with Cheshire were very satisfying to see too.
6. Jeanette is an original character, according to Gail Simone.
@Stu:
1. I’m a bit slow, I guess, because I’ve learned that a ton of people made the connection to Ragdoll early while I never guessed.
2. I like it, but I don’t think the ‘will this tear them apart’ at the beginning of their ongoing series is credible.
3. I was kind of hoping for Savant and Creote to join the team, actually. But I’ll make do with Bane. Not sure I’m a fan of the Daddy thing, though.
4. I haven’t really seen the tone of ‘Faces of Evil’ but I liked this book. It just focused a little more on Deadshot and gave him and emotional mini-arc. Compare that to the Nightwing, Vigilante team up with a nonsensical story that disrupted the flow of the rest of the book.
@david brothers: Knightfall Bane never really worked for me. He is one of those ‘service villains’ who aren’t established enough to have a consistent character, and so are used for whatever the artist needs.
However, I see him working with the Six, at least the way he is right now, as a good end-point ot the Gotham Knights redemption story he had, which was my favorite Bane story.
You know, for a shocking & kinda gross reveal the last page was suitably creepy, but because of the success of the overall surprise I think it was actually a kind of tasteful. Not the first kind you’d think of though.
Esther, I hope you wrote this article AFTER finishing your homework else I won’t let you go to Toys R Us next week.
I knew it was a Ragdoll, at least. I don’t really know what I think about it being one I’ve never heard of.
I do wonder why Simone hates Cheshire. I mean, the character used to be a bad-ass threat who could threaten entire teams. But in this and the ending of the original Villains United she comes off as a chump and a wimp…
@Gavok: AWWWWWWWWWWWWWWW. But I’ll DO it before we have to gooooOOOOOOOoooooo.
@LurkerWithout: Hm. I actually thought she was incredibly hardcore in Villains United.
Yeah, I always thought that Cheshire was one of those villains who was all about being ruthless and hardcore, but slightly below average in the straight-up fisticuffs area.
I mean, her gimmick is that she’s a chemist and a behind-your-back fighter. She shouldn’t be a team-killer at all. Most characters who are team-killers shouldn’t be, in fact.
1. I liked the Junior reveal. Ragdoll mentioned french-kissing his sister back in the Secret Six limited series in a clever bit of foreshadowing, and there’s just a proper sense of equality in letting the twisted psychotic be female for a change.
2. I doubt they’ll split up. Trying to kill each other is pretty standard for this group. If anything, they’ve been less dysfunctional than usual. I saw the group all agreeing to risk their lives rescuing Bane as the end of that possibility.
3. This was the first issue I really got a sense of Bane’s character. He’s starting to grow on me. There’s just something so endearing about ripping out someone’s throat with your teeth. I’m still waiting to see where his protectiveness of Scandal is coming from, though.
4. No, I really get the impression Gail simply turned in the script she would have written anyway. It doesn’t bother me though – I didn’t buy it for the event.
5. Hmmm, what else… I thought Chesire was dealt with a bit too easily, considering the gallons of bad blood between her and the other characters. I liked seeing Mr. Terrible, though.
6. Putting someone in an unusual outfit rather than spandex seems to be one of Gail Simone’s things. I recall her Action Comics run had an evil magnetic Bettie Page, whereas Jeannette is basically a super-strong Marie Antoinette. In any case, she broke the Shark’s jaw and ate little things on sticks. I’m sold.
Good call on the Junior foreshadowing.
I noticed another nice piece of foreshadowing from Villains United: “A lot of operatives we thought would join have been sending back our messengers in boxes and coffins: Manhunter, Creeper, Man-Bat, Bane…”
So he was always on the same page, he just ended up folding in the end.
@Master Mahan:
1. French kissing Ragdoll would turn me twisted, that’s true.
3. See, Bane is often portrayed as a ladies man, so I’m a little bit worried about it in general.
6. Did the sticks have the little foil decorations on the end? Because that’s the truly classy stick to eat off of.
@Gavok: Well, Secret Six now is different from Secret Six then. Then it was at the beck and call of a guy who refused to reveal his name. Now it’s just a group of mercenaries who tend to vote amongst themselves on the important stuff.
whatever the hell I want to talk about:
I would like to see more female heros in the comics. there are a few but could always use more.
@Esther Inglis-Arkell: I think you may have misinterpreted my quote. It wasn’t from the Secret Six, but from Talia in the Society. In other words, she’s saying, “The Secret Six want no part of us. You know who else wants no part of us? Bane.”
It makes his eventual inclusion feel a bit more natural.
@Gavok:
Dear Diary,
Was schooled in DC by a Marvelite. Must now plunge into the churning waters of the mighty Pacific.
Toodles,
Esther
I can’t believe that just happened.
(make mine marvel)
1. The reveal didn’t do much for me. The character of Junior pretty much worked as it was, having it be the sibling of one of the characters on the team was kinda unneccesary. It’s also awfully coincidental, but I guess that falls under the “if it’s good enough for Dickens…” rule.
2. Not a clue. The cohesion is not really that much worse than most of the other superhero teams out there. They bicker a bit, a fight might break out, but ultimately they’re all on the same side and have each other’s backs.
3. Good question. Truth is, Bane is the main reason I’m reading this book (I’m a pretty huge Bane fan). I’m not sure how I feel about Bane’s membership. It’s been kinda cool so far, opens the door for interesting developments and at the very least helps to keep the character in the spotlight, but it all feels a bit out of character for me. In the past, Bane rarely works with/for other people for a longer period of time, he usually betrays them when it was in his best interests. So putting him in a group such as this is weird. And he hasn’t actually done very much yet, has he? He used to be a guy who could match Batman physically and mentally, now it’s like he’s just muscle (I noticed the same thing during his Suicide Squad and Salvation Run period, during that time the only writer who got it right was Frank Tieri in Gotham Underground).
4. No. So a book that was about villains is, for one issue, a book about villains because of a special event (or whatever Faces of Evil is supposed to be)? However, it might result in a few extra readers, so that, at least, is a good thing.
David Brothers: “I’ve read a few Bane stories (Knightfall, that one where he thought he was Bruce’s brother, this one) and they all seem to have fairly different versions of the same character.”
If you want to see how the transition from “Knightfall” Bane to the later Bane worked, you could see if you can track down the Batman: Vengeance of Bane II one-shot and the 4 issue Batman: Bane of the Demon miniseries (both shouldn’t be too hard to find). Those stories act as a bridge between the end of “Knightfall” (Bane in prison) and “Legacy” (the start of the next big storyline he appeared in). Bane of the Demon is, in my opinion, especially good, and grants a lot of insight in Bane’s character and motivations.
Master Mahan: “I’m still waiting to see where his protectiveness of Scandal is coming from, though”
My guess is that Bane identifies with her because of their similar family situations (dead mother, absent father, left to fend for themselves in harsh conditions). Bane seems to be taking on a very paternal role with her, he’s acting like the father he never had.
@Derk van Santvoort:
1. The thing itself worked for me, but I didn’t see it as a last-panel shock, since it didn’t really change the story much.
2. Their membership is more stable than the JLA and the Outsiders.
3. Hm. I don’t know as much about Bane as you do, but after No Man’s Land I thought he got a lot more honorable. Besides that, I can see him refusing to betray the rest of the Six out of plain stubbornness, rather than anything else.
4. Anything that gets more readers. Seriously, I will go nutty if they cancel the Six. They’ve already taken BoP and the Blue Beetle. This is the book every month that I really look forward to.